Nifflas' Support Forum

Level Editing Support => Knytt Stories Level Editing Support => Topic started by: Exp HP on January 25, 2010, 01:27:35

Title: The Object Compendium
Post by: Exp HP on January 25, 2010, 01:27:35
For most of us, there are quite a few objects that we see in the editor and yet never use since we haven't the slightest idea what they do.
It's also sometimes difficult to tell apart the enemies; some of them can look quite similar at times even though they do completely different things.
Frankly, sometimes, it's hard to even tell who is an enemy and who is an NPC.  As it stands, the only way to find out is to try putting one in a level and giving yourself the Detector when you test it, because unless somebody is crazy enough to compile a full listing of all objects and what they do, you'll have to figure it all out yourself.

Well, you'll all probably be pleased to know that I am, as it stands, quite crazy.

Here's a guide with brief descriptions and pictures of each object.  It's not complete yet.


Color Key:
Friendly: This is a non-aggressive animal or NPC.
Hostile: This is an enemy or other deadly tile.
Special: This invisible object does something special.
Interactive: This visible object is tangible or affects the player in some other way.
Decorative: This object is purely visual.

These are To Do notes. Some are just notes to myself, but some may invite you to contribute!

✔ Thanks to Purple Pineapple for the images.
Progress:
(Finished: Banks 0, 1, 3, 5, 6, 9, 10, 12, 13, 15, 16)
(Next up: Bank 7 - Nature FX)

Spoiler: Bank 0: System (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Bank 1: Liquids (click to show/hide)




Spoiler: Bank 5: Shadow People (click to show/hide)


Spoiler: Bank 6: Traps (click to show/hide)



Spoiler: Bank 9: Flowers (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Bank 10: Bouncers (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Bank 11: Disks (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Bank 12: Ghosts (click to show/hide)




Spoiler: Bank 16: Invisible (click to show/hide)


Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Purple Pineapple on January 25, 2010, 01:43:43
For most of us, there are quite a few objects that we see in the editor and yet never use since we haven't the slightest idea what they do.
Then you just put them in a screen and find out. Like that white square that changes transparency. (15-25) :P

Anyway, this looks like it would be very helpful to people who are just finding out about KS. Or maybe even those who aren't. Regardless, it's a big project.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Firecat on January 25, 2010, 04:07:10
No way! I was going to do that T_T!. Yours its better through
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Pumpkinbot on January 25, 2010, 04:14:14
Must...Resist...Giving...Out... :hiddenstar:!

Ah, well, at least you deserve it. *tosses EHP a :hiddenstar:*
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Exp HP on January 25, 2010, 04:30:02
:hiddenstar:
Must... resist... placing star... in mouth...

(glomp)

Ow, it burns...
It buuuuurrrrrrrnnnnnnsssss...
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Pumpkinbot on January 25, 2010, 06:16:19
:hiddenstar:
Must... resist... placing star... in mouth...

(glomp)

Ow, it burns...
It buuuuurrrrrrrnnnnnnsssss...
"Glomp" does not mean "eat". "Glomp" means "OMG I LOVE [object]! *tackle*"
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: minmay on January 25, 2010, 16:45:33
If used as onomatopoeia, it can mean anything.  It only specifically refers to affectionately jumping on something if used as a verb.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: rrc2soft on January 25, 2010, 17:31:56
You can use the "I need help to make KSDS" (http://nifflas.lpchip.nl/index.php?topic=1090.0) Thread to know how some critters behave  :)
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Sendy on January 25, 2010, 17:46:48
I should think most veteran editors come to know what every object does, but this is a great idea... A couple of days ago, I made a list of all of the knytt/people in the 'Knytt/Fluff' bank, with details on their movement behaviour, because I got sick of having to place someone, and then test to see if they'd walk off a ledge or away from their dialogue.

So not only willl this help newbies a lot, it will also be useful for knowing the fine details of some of the objects. I could post my list, if it helps, but it only covers the people and a couple of the more confusing animals (such as those little walking balls, which have three kinds, and one of them grows spikes in your face when you get close), and how they face/move, and any other behaviour such as flying.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Purple Pineapple on January 25, 2010, 17:53:48
(such as those little walking balls, which have three kinds, and one of them grows spikes in your face when you get close)
The purple one, right?
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Sendy on January 25, 2010, 19:09:32
(such as those little walking balls, which have three kinds, and one of them grows spikes in your face when you get close)
The purple one, right?

One has neon red legs, one has orange legs, and one has purplish legs, the one with orange legs will kill you with it's spikes. That's caught me out numerous times.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Purple Pineapple on January 25, 2010, 20:15:37
Well, I knew it was the darker colour. :P
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Exp HP on January 26, 2010, 02:17:54
I should think most veteran editors come to know what every object does, but this is a great idea... A couple of days ago, I made a list of all of the knytt/people in the 'Knytt/Fluff' bank, with details on their movement behaviour, because I got sick of having to place someone, and then test to see if they'd walk off a ledge or away from their dialogue.

So not only willl this help newbies a lot, it will also be useful for knowing the fine details of some of the objects. I could post my list, if it helps, but it only covers the people and a couple of the more confusing animals (such as those little walking balls, which have three kinds, and one of them grows spikes in your face when you get close), and how they face/move, and any other behaviour such as flying.
Thanks, but I would be checking them all in the editor anyways... partly because you might have different criteria for classifying them, but mostly because I have OCD. XD

My guide was planned to have most of that information.  In each bank, stationary NPCs that face the player will be kept together as a group.  Moving ones will also be altogether in a group, and in the description under the group I will, in a paragraph, identify which ones: Fly, walk, or run, and whether they do so aimlessly, between fixed points, between walls, or following the player.

Then there's the stationary ones that don't face the player, as well as the moving ones that do something really special. I'll sort these out into groups on a case-by-case basis.  I'm trying to group ones that act similarly.  For instance, in bank 3, objects 12, 13, and 27, and any other people who stand there and wobble will be a group.  Lord knows what I'll call that group. X-P

I did something like this in the Ghost bank if you want to see it, but the number of NPCs in that bank is significantly less than this one.

This is not final, though.  It's what I'm going to use when I compile the draft of Bank 3, which is pretty much a project in and of itself.  I'll see what works and what doesn't work when I try it.


But to be clear, the two issues I'm focusing on addressing with my organization of NPCs is:
-How suitable they are as signs
-Who is friendly and who is hostile when NPCs and enemies look too similar
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Exp HP on January 26, 2010, 19:18:56
TABLES ARGHHHH

gfhjhggfklKLJRDVBRUKEGSREtiltrgiuotriou65
bppegespgoesjpbbbt !!!!! GAAAAAHHH!!!!!!
 >( >( >( >(


Unfortunately for me, the tables do make it look a lot more organized despite the fact they want to make me bang on the keyboard and spam angry smilies. So I guess they're a keeper. (Nooooooooooo....)

Bank 3 is done.

EDIT: And I just thought of a way to make the tables a lot easier to manage: I don't need separate rows for the images and the numbers if I just use line breaks.
Yay for keeping my sanity!

I'll stop posting status updates for now until it's complete.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Purple Pineapple on January 27, 2010, 01:44:06
Unfortunately for me, the tables do make it look a lot more organized despite the fact they want to make me bang on the keyboard and spam angry smilies. So I guess they're a keeper. (Nooooooooooo....)
Yay tables!
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Sendy on January 27, 2010, 21:11:27
The floating baby is basically the finish line in A Strange Dream, so I'm guessing that's why it's in there. I don't think it's been used for anything else, ever.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: jimj316 on January 28, 2010, 18:25:33
I (with nothing better to do) have made a list of creatures in bank 10 that I thought you might use:

Spoiler: (click to show/hide)

hope you like it  :)
and thanks for the object compendium, it's really useful ;)



Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Exp HP on January 30, 2010, 01:53:04
I just installed Ubuntu on my laptop. :crazy:


Thanks jimj316 for that list.  I haven't done any work at all on bank 10 yet, so that gives me a great start.  I'll format the list to work with the rest of the guide and I'll add the section some time after the upcoming site maintenance.  I'll add you to the credits when I do.


If anybody wants to help, here are some more sections that I don't plan on doing for a while:
Bank 11 - Disks (11 objects (but one doesn't exist)) ✔ Thanks, the Jack!
Bank 14 - Earth Beings (24 objects)
Bank 17 - Creepy (12 objects)
If you want to make a section, some details I would like to have are: Which ones are enemies & how do they attack, and for the ones that aren't enemies, how do they respond to the player?

Also, it'd really help me if somebody could just sort the objects in these banks into groups of similar-looking beings.
Bank 2 - Flyers (32 objects)
Bank 4 - Meanies (22 objects)
Having these banks already sorted would make them a lot less intimidating for me to work on.

I definitely plan on doing Banks 2 (Flyers), 4 (Meanies), 7 (Nature FX), 8 (Decoration), and 18 (Water Beings).
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Purple Pineapple on February 01, 2010, 06:43:32
Bounces up & down, getting higher on each bounce. Jump height resets every five jumps for Blue (no. 1), and every four jumps for Green (no. 8).
Use this:
Code: [Select]
...Green (no. 8[i][/i]).

(http://fintmcwells.com/NiffForum/Objects/Bank10/Object3)Random Bouncer
2
Bounces up & down at a random height each time.
Wrong image. :P

Note to self: Fix the transparencies already.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Exp HP on February 01, 2010, 07:20:15
I was debating whether or not I would turn off smilies in the post.  I remember deciding that I would just do, well, pretty much your suggestion there (put tags in it) to fix it.  And I remember doing just that.  So I'm confused at how that's there right now (didn't save that edit?), but I'll do it again.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Exp HP on February 06, 2010, 18:11:58
Quote from: The First Post
« Last Edit: February 01, 2010, 01:26:04 by Exp HP »

Man I'm lazy.  I really should start finishing this thing up...
Well, this and that I can hear you level that I don't really like.

I'll start doing Nature FX and Decorations ASAP.
Edit Feb 8: Okay, I lied.  Now I'll do it ASAP.
Edit Feb 10: Okay, I lied again.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: the Jack on February 08, 2010, 13:06:56
Well, as someone relatively new to KS -- both as a player and a would-be level creator fumbling my way through learning to use the editor -- this is unbelievably useful to me. Sure, each screen will still need to be checked even with the listings to refer to, but the Compendium is going to both save me a lot of additional trial and error, and also give me ideas.

As a show of my appreciation, here's a breakdown of Bank 11, Disks:

Spoiler: (click to show/hide)
Probably I'll do the similarity-sorting for bank 2 and/or 4 next -- give other people a chance to do a bank if they want. That was fun and edumacational to do! Thanks again for doing the bulk of the work, and for giving us the impetus to chip in.

[mod]removed unneeded colour formatting tags[/mod]
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: pumpkin on February 08, 2010, 20:28:22
 :crazy: UNBELIEVABLY USEFUL!!! Thanks! PS I hear you level? Do you have a beta of that or are you just going to release it when it's done?
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Exp HP on February 08, 2010, 23:08:25
As a show of my appreciation, here's a breakdown of Bank 11, Disks:
Excellent!  I'll format, tweak it, and get it into the guide.

Quote
(I hadn't even noticed, despite my exploration of and experimentation with the KS Editor, that Saucer #11 has a deployment issue before Exp HP pointed that out. Do we know what happened, there, or is it A Mystery?)
To my knowledge, other than the icon for it in the \Data\Objects folder (which the editor gets object icons from), there is no trace in the game of object 11-11.  Either the object was removed before the release of the game, or it was simply never implemented.
Nifflas explained it on the old forum, but that has been offline for a while.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: the Jack on February 10, 2010, 20:49:51
I got something like halfway through these before I remembered I was only supposed to sort the critters by similarity of appearance. Oops? There's some details I couldn't figure out for some of them (highlighted in blue for your convenience) which should probably go into the Compendium, though, so this section isn't quite all done now.

Bank 2: Flyers
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)

If you want me to just group Bank 4 by appearance, I can probably knock that out tonight (it's about 2:30pm my time now) or I can take a little more time and do it like I did this one. Whichever is more helpful for you.  :nuts:
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: RunMan on February 10, 2010, 21:17:59
#3 is black, #4 is red :)

About #20 and #21 timing. I am not pretty sure, but I think that they stay a little longer on the wall, which is opposite to the starting wall - it's about 2,5 seconds. On the starting wall they stay about 2 seconds.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Exp HP on February 11, 2010, 04:30:17
I won't work on adding Bank 2 right now, but I'll work from your data when I do.


I'll explain why I want them sorted.  The order is surely an aspect of importance in the compendium; a big part of the compendium is telling the difference between similar-looking objects.  If there are objects that are easily confused with each other and that need comparison, the compendium should compare them.

As for why I'm asking for somebody else to do it... well, that's a personal issue.
Coming from anyone other than me, such a statement would normally mean I don't want to go any further into detail, but I'm no good at practicing discretion, so what do you know, I spent an hour explaining it, anyways:
Spoiler: Explanation (click to show/hide)
So, well, there you go.


Edit:
Quote
*Its movement pattern is tricky to describe, but I could easily make a graphic representation in Photoshopped -- well, GIMPed -- screenshot form... if I'll be able to upload the image all right? I know many boards disable image upload or even linking for users by default, not sure how that works here...
If you want to share a picture, the form for attaching files is tucked away a menu in the Post Reply page.  Images have to be PNG, GIF, or JPG.
Alternatively, you can upload it to any image hosting site like tinypic.com or imgur.com and embed it in your post with [img] tags.  Actually, I think that's better than attaching it in most cases.
Both are allowed.  Here's a link to the Official Forum Rules, if you'd like to take a gander at them. ;)
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Purple Pineapple on July 02, 2010, 05:52:58
Is this still goin' on 'n stuff? ExpHP hasn't been on for two months.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: jimj316 on March 18, 2011, 20:34:29
If there was some way of editing Exp HP's post, I would be happy to finish this.

@admins: is it possible for you to edit other's posts? And is it allowed?
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: egomassive on March 18, 2011, 23:02:53
I was just thinking it would be nice if this could be finished. I directed someone with a question here the other day, and I didn't check to make sure it could actually help them.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Miss Paula on March 19, 2011, 02:06:50
obviously it is possible to edit others post for staff members. also obviously allowed. especially for lists like these, we're actually happy to update the thread's starting point, as long as we don't have to assemble the content ourselves. ;)
that means: sure, write the update(d post), for example in a pm, and send it, and we can copy it to the thread starter.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Loveless on July 15, 2015, 03:31:09
Not to revive an old thread or anything, but if anyone is interested I'm willing to mess around and see about finishing this compendium. For real.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: Fubaka on March 06, 2016, 07:32:03
Frankly this thread needs to be revitalized. All the images here are broken now.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: egomassive on March 06, 2016, 23:40:43
@Fubaka: Since the KS+ level editor gives a description for every object, I don't think there's a need for this anymore. Having the information in the editor is far more convenient than looking up this thread. Granted, not everyone uses the KS+ editor, but since it works for original KS levels too, everyone should be using it.

@People who came here for object information: You can get the editor I'm talking about here --> egomassive.com/ks (http://egomassive.com/ks)
Hover your mouse pointer over any part of the editor an press F1 to get a description of it's function. You may think this is shameless self-promotion, but you're the reason my editor has this functionality.
Title: Re: The Object Compendium
Post by: LPChip on March 06, 2016, 23:56:14
I'm removing this as a sticky because it is no longer having the images.